243. Dance Your Mission Statement with Kai Martinez

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Okay, well, let's then like, let's talk about the encanto. Encanto. [00:00:04] Speaker B: I'm so sorry. [00:00:07] Speaker A: I certainly can't handle my selfies. [00:00:11] Speaker B: I'm gonna take a. Take this moment to take a sip on that. Where's that movement? [00:00:17] Speaker A: Cute. Thanks for that. Hey, friend, it's Dana. Welcome to Words that Move Me. I'm glad you're here, but really stoked about this episode. I'm always stoked about my episodes. That's why I do them. Because this lights me up. Kai Martinez is our guest today and she is an absolutely incredible example of what is possible for women, specifically Latina women in dance and beyond. This is a brilliant person, a bright light in the dance community. I want to point out also several different pockets of the dance communities and she has a lot of brilliant things to say about how to find your brand, how to surround yourself with like minded people, how to become a person who is doing work that you feel like you were built to do. Like the work you were born for is the work you're doing. That's what we're getting into today. But first we do wins here on Words that move Me. And today I'm celebrating a very non dance related win. I have a patio. I mean, I have a house. You're in my house right now. This is my house. And just there beyond the lights is a patio that wraps around my condo, believe it or not. I mean, I'm going to say that's probably a. Was that 15, 18, maybe 25ft, maybe 30. Shit. Maybe 30 foot deck out there that has been largely unused because I cringe every time I go out there because it's dirty and the furniture isn't comfortable and it's the pits. Well, not anymore, my friends. I'm celebrating today that I have new patio furniture and I'm giving a special loving super shout out to Fee Voboff for helping me build my little sectional couch. And to Riley Higgins who built not one, but two little benches and, and a big table. And so now all of you can come over to my house and sit on the patio, which is gorgeous. And that is my win today. [00:02:22] Speaker B: How about you? [00:02:23] Speaker A: What is going well in your world or outside of your world? [00:02:40] Speaker B: Yay. [00:02:42] Speaker A: Congratulations. I'm so glad you're winning. Let's get into this conversation with Kai Martinez. I just. It's time. No. Yes, it. Welcome back to the podcast. So we had a technical difficulties first rounds. So we have. This is a round two and I'm so glad that you're here. Again, thank you for being here. How you been? [00:03:09] Speaker B: Thank you. I've been great. I've been great. I mean it's like now we're, we're into this year already and it's like, it's been a crazy year I think for an all. All ways. But finding ways to be creative and stay inspired I think is a collective. [00:03:27] Speaker A: Collective priority. Priority and struggle. Yeah. I'm glad, glad Riz is here to inspect our wide angle. Yeah, I think you're right. I've been hearing from a lot of people very stressed about a quieter time industry wise. And I also hearing from a lot of people who are getting down on their own projects, getting into training, a lot of people making use of having more time than maybe they might usually. But yeah. I'm curious, what, what creative ventures have you been up to? [00:03:56] Speaker B: I've been kind of feeling that also. And I think what's been helping me stay inspired is, is having a class I'm teaching right now, movement lifestyle and when I'm teaching Wednesdays at 4:00pm Good to know. I think having that constant like time slot demand, you have to make a. [00:04:14] Speaker A: Thing for that to be creative. [00:04:16] Speaker B: Right. I've been treating it as if it's a job and I like, meaning an industry job where I'm like, I go in a studio, I create and all that that the exchange within the class with the dancers and stuff has, has inspired me to then create on outside. So I just put out my own creative video to Black Sweat by Prince. [00:04:36] Speaker A: Heard of it. [00:04:37] Speaker B: It's just one of my favorite songs ever made. [00:04:39] Speaker A: I love that so much. Oof. Oof. [00:04:41] Speaker B: So hot. [00:04:42] Speaker A: Ooh. I've been back in friendship right now. It's very, very attractive to me to be listening to him right now. [00:04:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:04:49] Speaker A: Is Black Sweat already out there in the world? We can share it and see it. [00:04:52] Speaker B: I can't wait. Yes. And it was, you know, it was a challenge for myself to not just, you know, choreograph something, but also work on the lighting and the camera angles. And I wanted to do it in a. On a one take, you know, I really, you know, oner. Which. Right. So I love the idea of choreographing for the camera. [00:05:11] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:05:12] Speaker B: As well. [00:05:12] Speaker A: And that, my friend, is something that you gotta practice and if you're not gigging right now, be practicing on your own. [00:05:19] Speaker B: Practice on your own stuff. So I was, you know, I got, I had some great, great team behind me that helped me figure out from the haze and the, you know, all the things that I couldn't necessarily think of myself. [00:05:30] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:05:31] Speaker B: But, yeah, we did it. We got an amazing cast of dancers and so excited to watch. It's. It's hot. Yeah, it's hot. I love it. Yeah. [00:05:42] Speaker A: You're back on the podcast. This means now that we're into it, you have to reintroduce yourself. Tell us everything you want us to know about you. Who are you? Kai Martinez for the listener. Viewer. [00:05:51] Speaker B: Wow. I thought at the second time around. [00:05:52] Speaker A: That you didn't have to do that. [00:05:53] Speaker B: I know I wouldn't have to do that. Sorry. But. Yes. Okay. So my name is Kai Martinez Marquez. [00:06:00] Speaker A: Yes. [00:06:01] Speaker B: I am a Colombian American, first generation, born out of Queens, New York, Jackson Heights. What's up? I am a dancer. A lover, a fighter. No, a creative. And honestly, I. I live for the empowerment of women, of young people, and of our stories. And to be able to be a part of telling not just my stories, but the stories of my friends and stories of my communities and the communities around me is my life's mission. And it just so happens to be one of the mediums. Happens to be through dance. [00:06:40] Speaker A: Yo. Can I just say that I think it was meant to be that we had technical difficulties on round one, because that was a beautiful introduction. [00:06:49] Speaker B: Thank you for that. [00:06:49] Speaker A: That was beautiful. And, yeah, isn't it cool when, like, other people see you the way you see yourself? Because I see you as that person. [00:06:57] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Thank you. [00:06:59] Speaker A: Yes. A person who's connected to dance via. Or not. Not dance. Because stories. I think dance because of your lived experience as a person who grew up where you grew up, when you grew up in the family that you grew up in, but a person who prioritizes the importance of sharing versus keeping, of having something that's uniquely yours and dancing for uniquely yourself or uniquely a pop star. But it's something. I think when I watch you dance is designed to be shared. And so, yeah, I think that you're. I think your introduction is. [00:07:39] Speaker B: Thank you. Thank you. [00:07:41] Speaker A: Okay. One thing that you did leave out, though, from last time, that I want to lead with this time, because I think it's really, now more than ever, perhaps, important for dancers to be thinking about and to be doing. You have marketing background, right? [00:07:53] Speaker B: I do, yes. [00:07:55] Speaker A: Tell me a little bit about that and. And your tools for creating for yourself a brand identity. By the way, I'm wearing overalls today. [00:08:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:03] Speaker A: And they're. [00:08:04] Speaker B: And wearing this. We're just a band over here. [00:08:07] Speaker A: We're back marketing, branding. How did you get introduced to that? [00:08:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:13] Speaker A: And then tell us A little bit about your technique for building your. [00:08:17] Speaker B: Awesome. Yeah. So I actually went to St. John's University. Shout out St. John's for, like, communication arts, which. But I focused on marketing, advertising, and public relations. I also have a background because I went to Brooklyn Tech High School. Actually. Yesterday was my 20th anniversary. Say it's a reunion yesterday. It was yesterday. Actually. I didn't get to go, but shout out to Brooklyn Tech Tech nights. But when I was in that school, I also had. I also focused on, like, video production journalism. So I have just a wide background behind the scenes of Guess Entertainment and just branding and stuff. And I thought I threw it all away when I graduated from college, and I was like, I want to be a dancer. Little did I realize that as a. [00:09:07] Speaker A: Dancer, how deep that stuff that seed really took. Like, you kept that knowledge. [00:09:11] Speaker B: Yeah. And I. I realized very quickly that I had to. In order to stand out from the crowd. It was. It was the same. I had to apply the same rules that you would apply to a brand like a Coca Cola. Yeah. Any sort of product. I would have to look at myself that way. And it also helped me get out of my own way because I think as artists, we're very like, this is mine. And I'm so. We're so attached personally. We take everything personal. And we're so personally attached to our work because it's directly related to who we are. [00:09:44] Speaker A: Yes. Like our actual body. [00:09:46] Speaker B: Yeah. Like our actual physical. [00:09:47] Speaker A: Like, our body, our values, our experiences. [00:09:50] Speaker B: Yeah. Our hair, especially as women, our hair, our body shape, how much we show and all that. So we easily can be influenced if we don't have, like, a moral compass or if we don't have, like, our mission statement. Right. So I started to look at myself as that. Like, I would look at. There's this idea that I learned in school. It's called integrated marketing communications. And what that means is every point of contact that a consumer has with your brand, they should be getting the same messaging. [00:10:22] Speaker A: Mm. [00:10:23] Speaker B: Meaning if you, like, encounter Coca Cola, that's a huge brand. To. To that we can always. Case study. Anytime you encounter Coca Cola, the logo's always gonna look the same. You're always gonna get the same taste. It's always gonna be in the same packaging, you know, it's always gonna be in the same. It's consistent. Even the website, the social media, the events that it's a part of. You know what I mean? All of those things. It's because Coca Cola has a mission statement that they've developed to. That they paid some really smart person. [00:11:00] Speaker A: A lot of money. [00:11:01] Speaker B: It's like they're like Logline, right? It's their selling point. It's like, this is who we are, this is what we represent. And one of the biggest laws in marketing is to go from having the consumer having a want into a need. [00:11:16] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't just want a refreshing beverage. I need a Coca Cola. [00:11:20] Speaker B: Right. Because if you think about it, we don't need much of anything. Anything. We don't need new Jordans. We don't need. [00:11:26] Speaker A: No, we don't. [00:11:27] Speaker B: We don't. [00:11:28] Speaker A: We need to actually clear out some of the old ones is what we need to do. I'm in my spring cleaning judge right now. I'm really in the offload. But okay, so how do you do that as a dancer for yourself? [00:11:38] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. So now again, bringing that to yourself as a dancer. Nobody. They don't need me as a dancer. But how do I create that need? How do I create that for myself? And again, for me, the first step was creating a mission statement for myself. Like what do I stand for? What do I represent? What, what kind of artist do I want to be? And that, and I, I believe that we can't be everything when we want to be everything. And I had a experience kind of midway through my career where I went to a Brian Friedman audition. [00:12:10] Speaker A: Yes. Oh, having one of these aha, life affirming moments at a bride. [00:12:17] Speaker B: No. You know, I broke a nail, I was bleeding and I went, I was at center staging, sitting outside, defeated. I was completely defeated out there. I was like huffing and puffing and I was like down on myself. Like, man, I didn't do it, I didn't make it. And then I thought to myself, but that's just not. This is not who you are. [00:12:36] Speaker A: Yeah, that one. Yeah, that girl. [00:12:40] Speaker B: But I'm this girl over here, you know what I mean? And understanding, like it's okay to not be everything for everyone. [00:12:48] Speaker A: And it's informative to know who you. [00:12:50] Speaker B: Are, to know who you aren't. [00:12:51] Speaker A: In, in the process of discovering who you are. [00:12:54] Speaker B: Absolutely. [00:12:54] Speaker A: Okay, so you have the Brian Freeman audition. You have, I'm sure, several others. It's like, okay, I'm not that. [00:12:59] Speaker B: Yes. [00:12:59] Speaker A: Not that. You become a person who knows who you are, which is the person you introduce yourself as. So yeah, you figure that shit right out. And, and then what's the next step? [00:13:08] Speaker B: So you create a mission statement for yourself. Right. [00:13:10] Speaker A: So you know who you. And the mission statement is who you are. [00:13:12] Speaker B: Yeah. Mission statement. Who you are. [00:13:14] Speaker A: I'm a mission statement for the podcast. Podcast. I have mission statement for, like, my coaching and things like that, but a mission statement as myself. [00:13:20] Speaker B: Yeah. What would that look like? [00:13:22] Speaker A: Right. [00:13:22] Speaker B: If you think. I always say think about things that you. Because we are ever evolving, ever changing, so that may. That may shift and change. Oh, for sure. But what are your core, like, values of joy? Human person. [00:13:34] Speaker A: Dana Wilson is a joy machine. [00:13:35] Speaker B: Yes, you are. Yeah. [00:13:36] Speaker A: Okay. That's what. That's my. That would be my. What did you say? Tagline. [00:13:40] Speaker B: Yeah. Log line. [00:13:41] Speaker A: Logline. [00:13:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:43] Speaker A: Slug. Log line. Yeah. It's very important to me during this, like, moment in history, more than ever to be producing joy for myself, to be creating it and making it easily discoverable for other people as well. [00:14:02] Speaker B: And. Right. You want to know not only just who you are in this season of your life. Right. Because again, that does change as we. But also, what do you stand for? And I think that is a question that doesn't necessarily change. Right. I think if you can stand for women's empowerment through different types of movement. Right. And then you have, like, a certain type of that that can exude a certain type of work. And so I think for me, when I. When I thought of that, what is important? What do I stand for? And I think I am very passionate about empowering women and champion women and then also children, because coming from where I come from, I was back there last year and dance, seeing some of the dancers that come from underprivileged neighborhoods, underserved neighborhoods and minorities. I hate the word minorities, by the way. But black and brown and Asian, just like. But their passion is so much there that I'm like, I remember being that. And so that's something I'm very passionate about to show them. Like, yo, if I can do that, you can too. And also the telling of our stories, I think not just myself as a Latin woman, but I love learning stories about different cultures and being able to somehow be involved in that. So once I started getting that together for myself, it just helped me align with the right projects and the right work. Cause once you. It's like when you're tuned into a certain frequency, like a radio station, you tune into power 105 or whatever station that is, you're only gonna listen to on that station on that frequency. And the same thing it comes when. When we're in our mind, when we're focused on certain things. Like you said, joy, that's so real, because anytime I see you, I feel joy. And so you exude that because you're so tuned into that frequency. [00:15:58] Speaker A: That's me showing up. This is me showing up. Consistency consistently. And that's. And that's, that's why it's. Man, this is tricky. That is who I am. I guarantee you. I am a full, well rounded person that doesn't feel joy 100% of the time. I feel the full spectrum. [00:16:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:20] Speaker A: But I. Yeah. I have been by people who are very, very close. Close to me. Been criticized for my rose colored glasses. I think I default to positive. But that isn't to say that I don't feel the rest of it. But I think what I'm trying to say here is as you're choosing who you want to present yourself as. [00:16:46] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:47] Speaker A: Probably put your strengths and your defaults right at the center of that so that you don't have to worry about being a person that you're not consistently all the time in places where you show up to work. [00:16:59] Speaker B: Yeah. And then that will also, you know, of course, of course we don't feel that all the time, but then that's when we. We're able to separate the person from our brand. [00:17:11] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:17:12] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. If the brand is. So maybe on a day where you don't feel so joyful and you know, you have to show up somewhere, you know, you have to. But because that is your brand, it will help you pull you out the person out of whatever space you're in and show up for that one hour, for that two hours, as for that 16 hours sometimes. [00:17:35] Speaker A: Yeah, I hear that. Okay. I want to jump back to that Brian Friedman moment because I think a lot of people in that moment could stop, but you didn't. So I want to know about what came right after that, like weeks after, days after. What happens after you get the super hard on yourself moment of like, I'm not it. [00:17:56] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, I. Before I. I'll go back to the Brian Friedman moment. Cause I think that. Well, that moment for me was a affirming moment. So it was. I had already been around for a while and I had already a sense of who I was. And I think I was trying to see how. Cause I've also had beautiful experiences with choreographers and people that I never thought I would work with. You know, I worked with Ryan Huffington and I never thought I'd work with someone of his wheelhouse of work, but I had the most beautiful experience working with him. So I think I was in an open space of like, who else can I work with, you know, outside of the street dance world? And when that happened, it was more of affirming, like, okay, you tried it, but you're not that. And now let's continue working on our strengths. But before that, I did have a very difficult, like, a hard lesson. I. So I was at an audition and Othan saw me at the audition and Jamaica was there. And then Jamaica asked Othan to get my number, and they called me to come into a private audition. [00:19:12] Speaker A: Okay. [00:19:14] Speaker B: And so I came into this private audition. It was for Usher, and it was just Usher in the room and Jamaica and I think Rio. No pressure, no pressure. [00:19:24] Speaker A: I didn't even schedule afternoon. [00:19:26] Speaker B: This was like. This was maybe a year when I first moved to la. So I was still fresh here and still, again, trying there. I was really trying to find my footing in la. And now Usher asked me to freestyle. He was like, hey, so what song you want me to play? I just want to see you dance. [00:19:43] Speaker A: What'd you say? What song? [00:19:45] Speaker B: I think he was. He was doing. I said something Michael Jackson. Because he was doing, like, a Michael Jackson tribute. I was like, yeah, Michael Jackson, girl. I can't remember the rest. It was. I blanked. I know. I just went totally black out. [00:19:57] Speaker A: Totally. [00:19:57] Speaker B: You know when you're in that time when you're just, like, dancing and you're just like. I was pulling from every style that I knew. I was just. [00:20:03] Speaker A: Oh, shit. [00:20:04] Speaker B: It was a smorgasborg. [00:20:06] Speaker A: Slightly out of control. Just, like, throwing all the things. [00:20:09] Speaker B: Yeah, just doing nerves. You're not grounded. I wasn't grounded in myself. And needless to say, I didn't get the job. And that is the first time I had to sit with myself and really, like, take accountability for. I did not get that job. Because of me. There was no, like, literally, it was handed to me. It was set up for me. And all they wanted to do was just see what I. Who I was. And that would. That definitely had a. That would. I think, would have. Would have crushed me. But what it did was I was like, no, this is never happening to me again, okay? And I was in every session, every freestyle session. I was at every party. I'm at every cipher. I. You know, I'm grateful. I've had some incredible mentors in the freestyle world, like Henry Link, Hip hop. OG is one of my mentors. Popping pee. You know, I've learned from Buddhist Stretch. And just coming from New York, you see, like, you go to Funkbox, it's a masterclass. And that's who's there, and that's who's. [00:21:11] Speaker A: There, right Link made me put my hand on Funkbox once on the bar. Cause, I don't know, I probably waved at some point. And he was like. [00:21:22] Speaker B: Come here. [00:21:23] Speaker A: Sat my arm on the bar and would not let me get past my knuckles if I lifted my other knuckle first. He was like, no, you're pressing. Do you feel yourself pressing right here at. Who does. He's a teacher. He's a teacher through and through. [00:21:36] Speaker B: Yes, he loves. [00:21:38] Speaker A: First of all, him getting down is, like you said, a master class. This is an Ivy League education just to see him get down. Yeah, but he's so generous in what he offers and how he shares. [00:21:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:48] Speaker A: I'm so grateful to have encountered him. [00:21:49] Speaker B: Yes. I still call him up from time to time. And the other day we were talking about DJing, and he's like, pull up your. Pull up your serato. And he's like, teaching me stuff. Yeah, man, I love him. And, and one of the things that he told me back then when I was in New York still, I was at Funkbox, and he invited me into the Cipher, and I was like, no, no, no, no, I, I can't, I'm not, I don't want to, you know, I was like, very standoffish. And he was like, well, how would you. You're coming into this space and you're receiving energy from everyone. It's an energy exchange. And how. You're not, you're not giving, you're just receiving. I was like, oh, I didn't see it that way. [00:22:30] Speaker A: You want to just come in here and be a taker. [00:22:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:32] Speaker A: You come into somebody's house and just take and then leave. [00:22:36] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:22:36] Speaker A: Without bringing. Yeah. [00:22:38] Speaker B: Second thing he said was, if you don't like your dance, how do you expect anyone else to? And then flashback to. Fast forward to the Usher situation. I was like, wow. Yeah. [00:22:50] Speaker A: I wouldn't like what I did. [00:22:51] Speaker B: I just didn't even know what I was doing. I didn't know myself. I didn't know I couldn't sit in the music. I just, it was so. I, I, I knew I had a lot of foundation, but I didn't know my. I didn't have an identity within that foundation. Like, you know, you go take these, like, house class, blocking, popping, and you vocab, Vocab, vocab. [00:23:10] Speaker A: Words, Words. [00:23:10] Speaker B: Even in the, you know, jazz world, too. Jazz, contemporary, you just have all this vocabulary, but if they play a song, you're just gonna like an 8. A foundation here and a little pacing and then a little whacking and you know, you don't. I think the artistry in dance comes in how you put it together and how you present it. [00:23:27] Speaker A: You know, how you speak. It becomes poetry. You can learn the vocabulary of a dance and write the sentence. See spot, run. Or you can become Joshua from Ghetto Funk Collective and be speaking Shakespeare with the vocabulary. Like, he's using the vocab, but he's speaking fucking Shakespeare. I get. I'm with you. I'm fucking with you fully. And I share in. In that for a long time. Freestyle was terrifying to me. It's not. Not. It's not my strength. It's not my comfort zone. I would rather. [00:24:00] Speaker B: Look who's talking, guys. [00:24:02] Speaker A: Well, I'm. I'm becoming. I'm still becoming a better seller. And I think. I don't mind being a beginner. I don't mind humbling down. I. It's okay with me. I know that. I know that. It's like a part of me, actually, to have certain strengths and certain weaknesses. Like, that's my fucking flavor. That's like. And I'm so down. That's fine with me. That's totally fine. But I do aspire to becoming a wordsmith with movement in all dance spaces, in the freestyle space, in choreography space, in social dance spaces. Oh, God. My. My God. I'm really pretty good, but okay. All of words happening. What I'm hearing from you is that. Well, two things. Number one thing. You said that you didn't get that job because of you. [00:24:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:51] Speaker A: As your friend, I would tell you that you didn't get that job because of that job. Because you are exceptional. Whether you knew exactly what to say in that moment or not. There's nothing wrong with you. You and that job. Not meant to be. [00:25:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:06] Speaker A: Just not a partnership. Not meant to be. I have felt, oh, God. Me and this job are made for each other, and then found out that I was wrong. [00:25:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:13] Speaker A: And that's fine. It's okay to be wrong. [00:25:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:16] Speaker A: Especially about relationships. Like, oh, thought that was going to really be good and really wasn't. And that's fine. Like, that's okay. But I. I don't think it was you. I think it was the job. That's number one. Number two, what it did is. Is put you into spaces. You were like, okay, never that. Never that again. [00:25:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:33] Speaker A: I'm gonna take myself into spaces to help me make sure that that doesn't happen. And those spaces for you happened to really return on the investment. So it's you finding, like you were talking about earlier. Your people, once you have your North Star, your mission statement, that puts you in the spaces where people like you live. And then you wind up working on encanto because you're a Latin woman who cares about sharing stories about women, who cares about them being accessible to children. And when you, like, decide who you are and what's important to you, you land in spaces where you get to do that kind of work. So that's what I'm seeing, like, from my 30,000 foot view of you telling a story. It probably didn't make that much sense at the time, but because of all those. Oh, I'm not. That you wind up in the space where you're like, wow, I'm doing work that I'm so fucking proud of. [00:26:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:21] Speaker A: At least I hope so. [00:26:22] Speaker B: I know. [00:26:22] Speaker A: Are you? [00:26:23] Speaker B: Absolutely. [00:26:23] Speaker A: Okay, well, let's then, like, let's talk about the encanto in Encanto. [00:26:28] Speaker B: I'm so sorry. [00:26:30] Speaker A: I certainly can't handle myself. [00:26:35] Speaker B: I'm gonna take a. Take this moment to take a sip on that. Where's that movement? [00:26:41] Speaker A: Cute. Thanks for that. Can you. I mean, in my mind, that's one of those, like, I was built for this kind of projects, you know? Like, it seems like you from day one, whether you knew it or not, we're like on a pathway to that gig. Is that how it felt? [00:26:59] Speaker B: It felt. It. It did. It felt tailor made in the most. In the strangest way. Like, you know, there was. I had many moments of tears. I had many moments of, like, what is the. Is going on? Right? Like, what is happening from the moment it. I got the call from Jamal Sims as a choreographer on. [00:27:23] Speaker A: Jamal, love you, Jamal. [00:27:24] Speaker B: We love you. Jamal, we love you. No. Yeah. I mean, the incredible, iconic, like. And I don't say that lightly. Jamal Sims, who. He came into the project and he says the story himself. Like, he. He didn't want to take the job because he. Of the. The subject matter of it being Colombian culture. Yeah. He's not Latino. And so he. Even him having the understanding and not having the ego to say, I'm gonna do this, and saying, oh, I'm gonna bring someone on board who is more of an expert in that field. But also, I mean, he's just an incredible storyteller. So I think he was exactly the right person to be the. To spearhead this project because of the way. The way in which he tells stories through dance and film is just. [00:28:15] Speaker A: And the way he leads a team and the way. [00:28:17] Speaker B: Yes. [00:28:17] Speaker A: The way he holds a room. I do think it's important that people like yourself, who is the person who lived that thing, should be leading teams. And I understand that Jamal, with all of his experience doing this, would be the person who's head of department. I get that. And I'm grateful for Jamal to have the wherewithal and the network to pull yourself into the team like that. And I'm allowed to think that and still want you to have been the leader of that. [00:28:52] Speaker B: Yeah. Like, I. [00:28:55] Speaker A: Also, women. Women in positions of power is a passion of mine. And I, I. I think it is so wild that dance is such a. Obviously, dance is global. Dance is for everyone. But I think most is this stupid that I'm saying this. At least the way that I grew up, like, 95% of dancers were women and 95% of choreographers are men. [00:29:27] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:28] Speaker A: And I just kind of want to fuck that up. [00:29:31] Speaker B: Yeah. Same way. [00:29:36] Speaker A: So thank you, Jamal, for that. And also cheers to you for your future leadership positions, because you got to learn from somebody who's really, really good at it. And I'm sure. Tell me maybe about one aha. Moment you had on that project. [00:29:48] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh, so many. But, yes, I would say that the person that I am now, even just five years later, it's not the person that I was when I walked into that space, so. Meaning I was coming from the dance world. I had an knee injury in 2017. I didn't know if I, you know, I was. [00:30:07] Speaker A: What year. What year did you work on Encanto? [00:30:10] Speaker B: 2021. [00:30:12] Speaker A: Okay. Oh, shit. [00:30:13] Speaker B: Yeah. So it was after, like, 2018, when I kind of got back, when we did a Man of the woods, actually. Man of the Woods. Justin Timberlake video. Yeah, that was my first video. That was my first job back from knee surgery. [00:30:25] Speaker A: Wow. [00:30:26] Speaker B: I had ACL and meniscus, and I was kind of in this existential crisis. But that. That shout out to Marty and AJ and the whole team, because that kind of brought me back into dance. [00:30:40] Speaker A: You were like, okay, I can still do this. [00:30:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:30:41] Speaker A: Thing I can do and I can do. [00:30:43] Speaker B: But even then, I was still struggling with, like, again, where's my new. Where's my new space in this? Because after you have an injury and then getting older, you're so much. [00:30:52] Speaker A: These are character defining. These are. Yeah, yeah. Rebrand moments. [00:30:57] Speaker B: Yeah, Rebrand moments. So fast forward to Pandemic. I was on tour when the Pandemic happened with Omarion as a dancer, and I kind of was like, in this. Do I really want to do this? I had already started choreographing but I didn't know if I wanted to do that. So just kind of in this transitional space. So when I got the call from Jamal to do Encanto, I was like, first of all, the fact that Disney wants to do a movie on Latin culture, let alone Colombian. What? Like, it was insane. My mind couldn't wrap my head around it, but I was like, immediately like, okay, let's do the best job that we can. So I felt also this immense amount of pressure, responsibility, and responsibility to represent a whole country of diversity and people and dance and music. And every area has its own different type of dance and music. [00:31:57] Speaker A: There's no end to how deep you could go in the quest for authenticity. [00:32:02] Speaker B: Yes. [00:32:02] Speaker A: Yeah, there's no end. [00:32:03] Speaker B: And wanting to do it justice, you know. And so then came a wave of imposter syndrome where. Well, hold on. I'm from Jackson Heights. Granted, Jackson Heights is a historically Colombian neighborhood. However, being born and raised in the US I didn't feel like I grew up feeling like I was too American for the Colombian side and Latino to Colombian for the American side. So I think I know that this is something that a lot of first generation children of immigrants feel, because at home, we're very much raised. I was with the music, the food, the culture, the news. I would watch, like, Latin news, and everything was like, contained in the house. [00:32:48] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:32:48] Speaker B: And as soon as I walked outside, I was like, yo, what's up, hip hop and Biggie and, you know, all types of. And. And so my two worlds became very separate. [00:32:58] Speaker A: Right. [00:32:59] Speaker B: And then even as a dancer, when I started dancing, I was like, well, I like whacking and voguing and house and hip hop. And I had danced salsa, but I was like, kind of at the house. Yeah. It was kind of like. It wasn't like mainstream cool, Right. To be dancing salsa, at least in my brain. [00:33:14] Speaker A: Right. [00:33:15] Speaker B: And then so as I. As I grew as a dancer and as a person, I start. It always kind of separated. I kept it separated. And then Encanto asked me to bring both my worlds together. And that just asked me to. It made it okay. And I think that was something that I didn't know I needed a validation that I didn't know I needed. Especially coming out of the Pandemic when we're all talking about racial relations and just cultures and different things and finding out who. Who we are and being authentically who we are. That project, throughout that project coming in. And I also, outside of being associate choreographer with Jamal, I, through him production, asked him If I could also be a consultant. Yeah. On the project. And again, shout out to Jamal, because not only did he bring me in to work with him, but he empowered me to be in this room, in this space. And again, we're talking about women, and sometimes we need someone to help us to. Sometimes we. Whether it's another woman helping us or a man or someone to help us be in those spaces. And so he definitely empowered me and took a risk. Right. Because I was now working with the animation team very closely. I was an employee of Disney. I was working with the directors. I was in their space. And so what he did was say. [00:34:44] Speaker A: Hey, choreo team person, who I maybe want to be exclusively a choreo team person. I'm going to share you with other teams and the rest of this project, which is selfless, because it makes you, in some ways less available to him, but more available to the project. And I think that's what makes Jamal amazing at what he does, is that it's project fucking first. [00:35:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:06] Speaker A: And there's very little ego in that equation for him. It's like, is it best for the project? Great. Then do it. [00:35:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:13] Speaker A: Regardless of whether or not it's best for him. [00:35:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:15] Speaker A: So this totally tracks. [00:35:16] Speaker B: And I love this story. [00:35:17] Speaker A: Okay, keep going. [00:35:19] Speaker B: So then with that, I. I came in and I was working with the animation team on the dance sequences. So we were. We were taking the dance sequences apart and making sure that they were precise. So I was treating the characters as if they were dancing. [00:35:33] Speaker A: Like, shape of their hands or, like, the way they're moving their dress. [00:35:36] Speaker B: Like, everything. Like, rotation of the hips. [00:35:38] Speaker A: You guys did movement. Like the. It wasn't motion capture. It was movement reference for the animators, which you've done. But I really love getting to feel and look myself. [00:35:49] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:49] Speaker A: And then let the animators do their job. [00:35:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:52] Speaker A: So anyways. [00:35:53] Speaker B: Yes. [00:35:54] Speaker A: Do it. Love it. But so you guys did the reference, and then you would also be in on those animation sessions, like, looking at. Oh, cool. [00:36:03] Speaker B: Which was not normally what happens. There were a couple things that were unique to this project. Like, number one, when we did. We don't talk about Bruno, all we had were the storyboards. So we didn't have what's called a layout, which is when they kind of, like, preset the cameras in the animation, which means it's kind of, like, already set. Like, the shots are set. Right. And you kind of have to just fill in the shots. So all we had was the storyboard. So we got into. We went to studio and we just created. And Jamal created it in a one take, a oner also. And he shot it and they used that video to inform the layout. Yeah, that's cool. And that was something that we found out later is not normally done because it's usually done the other way around. So I was like, that's kind of. [00:36:54] Speaker A: Like Jamal kind of directed. Yeah. That kind of is director, which happens a lot. [00:36:59] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:36:59] Speaker A: I think it's a really interesting. [00:37:02] Speaker B: I know. You know, conversation to be had. Directed. [00:37:11] Speaker A: Yeah. This is a really interesting kind of blending of roles and responsibilities between directors and choreographers. And I think that's another reason where that Jamal is delightful to work with is because he's happy to do more. But he's also a person who advocates for proper credit. And he's one of our vice presidents for the choreography skill. [00:37:36] Speaker B: Yeah. Shout out choreographer skill. [00:37:37] Speaker A: He's so, so influential and important in having his voice in the room for these kind of conversations where we're discussing what are the roles and responsibilities of a choreographer actually and what aren't. But I think it sounds like that happened exactly the way that it should have. And that number is outstanding. It's so good. [00:37:57] Speaker B: Thank you. Yeah. It went on to impact so many people. So that just. Again, that's a testament to the storytelling, the love and passion that we all put into that room. We had Raina Hidalgo, Asiel Hardison, Yowi Yarelis. We had Yai, who's Colombian Mark Villiver. Trying to think who. I hope I'm not missing anyone, but it was a small cast. It was like six of us. [00:38:23] Speaker A: Good squad. [00:38:23] Speaker B: Good squad. [00:38:24] Speaker A: Lean storytelling machine right there. [00:38:27] Speaker B: Yes. And most all Latinos. Yep. Too. So. So anyway, so after that, Right. Usually that's kind of where the job of the. The choreography team goes. Is done. It's like, boom, we did the reference. [00:38:39] Speaker A: You're lucky if you get to see an edit. [00:38:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:41] Speaker A: I got to see an edit of in the Heights early on. But, like, that's rare. It's rare that you get to give note. Choreography notes. [00:38:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:51] Speaker A: That will be considered in the edit. That's rare. [00:38:53] Speaker B: That's special. So. So then what? The opportunity that I had now was I worked with the animation team for six months after we finished. After we finished doing all the references and we went back to each sequence and now was like, well, the rotation in her hip needs to be like such. And the hip, like Dolores, when she's, like, lifting her hip up, has to be on the beat, you know, and it's like guiding that part Guiding a team who's not necessarily, you know, they're doing the best they can and that's not their strong thing. Yeah. [00:39:26] Speaker A: It's not their life. [00:39:27] Speaker B: And they're animating a musical number. I think it's through there. And shout out to Michael Woodside from Disney Animation Team. He was the one of the supervisors on the squad. He really advocated and still advocates for the dance world and the choreography world and animation world to work together, especially on these musical sequences. Because I think after watching that, the end result of Encanto, I was like, wow, it really made a difference. And I've worked on other projects or I've seen other projects that didn't quite have that. And so you just, you see that it, it's like you see the movement but as dancers and you would know, you know, it's amazing. Absolutely. [00:40:14] Speaker A: Can we, can we like ungentle segue really quick? Yeah, I want to talk about jealousy really quick. [00:40:19] Speaker B: Ah. [00:40:20] Speaker A: Oh, by the way, this is so interesting. So there's a 12 week program called the Artist's Way. It's written by. I fucking forgot her name. [00:40:31] Speaker B: Yes. I still have to start it. I have it. I have the workbook. [00:40:34] Speaker A: Julia. Julia Cameron. Julia Cameron. So I've been wanting to discuss this on the podcast because I did not enjoy my experience. I didn't finish the 12 weeks. There's a few things that came up for me about why and I'll. Maybe I'll do a podcast about it someday. I opened my Instagram yesterday and Dochi is doing the Artist's Way, talking about the Artist Way, asking who all my followers do in the Artist's Way. I'm on week two, I think she's on week two. And I love this. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, oh, of course. Now I'm curious about doing it again. [00:41:09] Speaker B: But I need to start it so we can start it together. [00:41:12] Speaker A: It's an interesting thing and you can do it a thousand different times because there's some self direction involved. You don't, you don't have to do every exercise in every week. You get to select. Okay, yeah, I think I'll try that thing. Or I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna do this. There's a lot of customization and I think it's designed so that you could do it many times and always get something different out of it. But one of the tools that I did really love from the Artist's Way is something called a jealousy map. And it basically works to rebrand jealousy, not as something bad that we shouldn't feel and that you're bad for feeling in the first place. Like, don't be jealous just because Kai got to work with Anderson Paak. But spoiler alert, you landed on my jealousy map because I found that you have done some movement, coaching and choreography for Anderson. And I am a huge fan. Like, crazy, crazy big fan. I'm tearing up because, listen, like, I love Bruno Mars. Okay? [00:42:22] Speaker B: Shout out to Bruno Mars. [00:42:23] Speaker A: He's amazing and he's fucking unreal. I've seen him live a couple times. Holds the room right here. You are lapping men, women, children, dogs. Lapping out of his hand. [00:42:36] Speaker B: And that microphone is on. [00:42:37] Speaker A: And that microphone is on. And he is jamming and is charismatic. Anyways, I obviously have thoughts about Bruno. [00:42:44] Speaker B: Mars, but I want to see Silk. [00:42:46] Speaker A: Sonic, and guess who I watched? Anderson Paak. [00:42:52] Speaker B: The other guy. [00:42:52] Speaker A: There's the other guy. And so anyways, I encourage you to look into the jealousy map. You can probably find this as an individual thing. It encourages you to use jealousy as a tool, as a navigational tool. Right. If I know that that feeling is coming up for me with you, I can ask myself, why? Okay, then why that? Okay, then why that? Okay, and why that? And eventually you'll get. The bottom line will be because I want to feel seen or because I want to feel like I'm at the top of my game working with my heroes or because, you know, so is there something that I can do right fucking now that will get me closer to that feeling? Wow, absolutely. So I can take what would have been a quick scroll like, oh, no, no, no, don't feel jealous. And just, like, actually ask why? What is going on here? And what can I do right now that will land me closer to those results today? So I've gone through the jealousy map with you a couple times. [00:43:50] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh, that's so crazy. [00:43:51] Speaker A: But I would love to hear, since I have you here, a little bit about how you came to be doing that work. What is your experience like working with him? And hopefully there's more in the future because, fuck, what you're doing is working. I just. I think the world of him and obviously of you. [00:44:07] Speaker B: No, yeah, no, totally. I. Which is. I will say. I'll preface it by saying it's crazy because I remember coming up in New York, I was watching. I would be on YouTube videos, and I wasn't really a YouTube because there was like a stigma about, like, YouTube in New York. It was like, la YouTube. [00:44:24] Speaker A: That's crazy. [00:44:25] Speaker B: Yeah, it was like the YouTube dancer. It's like, it's like, it's like what. What we see as tick tock now, that's kind of like what that. The. The perception. It's the new thing. It's like, look at these people taking advantage of. But I watched you and Sean and Jillian and I was like, yo, I don't care what nobody says. These people, they're getting down and they are so like, y' all. It really inspired me. The way you move was like, so. Because I was just. I was a very full out dancer and kind of like sloppy and very, like, raw. And I was like, whoa, no, I want to dance like that. I want to be so control. In control of my body. So. So to then come here and meet you guys, and you guys are as wonderful as you are dancers. Like, like, the way you move is like, so to hear, to have this moment, I'm like, girl, what? [00:45:19] Speaker A: Isn't that crazy? [00:45:20] Speaker B: Jealousy? [00:45:20] Speaker A: Isn't that crazy? And that's the other thing about jealousy is like, everyone will feel it. Yeah, everyone will be jealous of someone and you might be mutually jealous. Right? [00:45:30] Speaker B: I'm like, what, are you kidding me right now? [00:45:32] Speaker A: I love that all the stuff you've done. That's cool. Thank you for that pause. [00:45:35] Speaker B: That's important. But. Okay, so with. With the way Anderson happened was. It was very. I'm trying to. Let me be concise here. It was. It was a very interesting path that I didn't. That led to it eventually. It wasn't something that I was like, targeted him as an artist because again, at that point, this was. This was 2018. So I had just come back from my knee surgery and I was in this space and I went to. I went to a Janet Jackson audition. When she came back, it was a big open call and everyone was so excited. And I was like, why am I not excited? Like, I'm like, I'm not. I'm not. [00:46:18] Speaker A: That's such an important question. [00:46:19] Speaker B: Like, something just didn't feel like this was my dream and. But I did. It got to the end, you know, callback, whatever. It was great. I felt good about myself. And then when I went home, I just kind of sat with myself and I. I heard, you know, spiritually, her discernment, however you want to call it something, tell me like, it's. Janet's already a well oiled machine. You want to be part of the next. I was like, I want to be part of the next. What are you talking about? And I was like, yeah, you. You want to be part of building up the next machine or the next. Yeah, you want to be a part. You want to be from the ground up. You want to help build it from the ground up. So that was one thing. And then another thing was like, instead of trying to look up, look out around, look around you. [00:47:08] Speaker A: Beside. [00:47:08] Speaker B: Yeah, this idea of networking so important horizontally instead of vertically. Right. And so a friend of mine had moved out here, and we've known each other since we were teenagers, and she's singer, songwriter, shout out Coco Sarai. And she came out here, and she just started working with Dr. Dre at Aftermath. She was writing and working with him, and his studio is right here in Sherman Oaks. And I didn't. I knew she was doing that, but I wasn't heavily invested in what was happening. But I reached out to her and a couple of my other friends who are. Who are artists, and I was like, hey, I just want you to know, if you ever need any help from me, like, I'm down to help you. Any movement, any. You know, I just wrist the spotlight. She's like, I want to know. I have something to say. So I told her, you know, it's just gonna happen. Is it good? [00:48:14] Speaker A: Oh, okay. Okay. [00:48:16] Speaker B: I told her, like, hey, if you ever need any help with any movement, like, let me know. I'm always down to help. And she was like, well, yeah, actually, I would love to get in with you and just kind of, like, work on walking and just, like, simple things. [00:48:28] Speaker A: Embodiment. [00:48:29] Speaker B: Just embodiment. Yeah. Now I was like, okay, let's do it. And we had worked together when we lived in New York, so we kind of had this relationship already. And in one of those moments where we. One of those times that we were together, she actually got a call to come into the studio with Dr. Jade. And she was like, hey, do you want to come with me? I was like, yeah. I was like, who says no to that question? [00:48:52] Speaker A: I want to know. Yeah. [00:48:54] Speaker B: And so I. I went. And I. I was, like, blinking. I think I said this last time, too, because I really was my visual, like, actual life. [00:49:04] Speaker A: Is this real? [00:49:05] Speaker B: Yeah. I was like, I need to take a picture of this, but I can't. So my brain. I need to, like, snapshots, blink. Snapshots. Snapshots with my brain. [00:49:13] Speaker A: Stop it. I love that. [00:49:14] Speaker B: And, yeah, so I was in there, and they were. They were working on Oxnard, So he was mixing Oxnard and got to witness Dr. Dre, like, everything is true. The loud. It gets really loud in there, and. But it was like again, just a privilege. And then in walks Anderson and got to meet him and everything was really cool. Chill got cut to another time. They, they were starting to do like some promo for Oxnard, I think around this time. And Coco again asked me like, hey, you know, he asked me to go on stage with him. Can you like come to rehearsal and just like help me with like some. Just walking. Yeah, give me some things to do. And I was like, of course, sure. So I come to rehearsal and I'm just in the corner tucked away. I'm not trying to fly on the wall. And whenever she would do something, I would just go to her quietly and be like, hey, why don't you try this? You know, and at one point he goes like, hey, what about me? And I was like, well, you know. [00:50:15] Speaker A: Yes, what about you? [00:50:17] Speaker B: You could try. [00:50:17] Speaker A: I am gay. I have 100% not been the person to be in that room. [00:50:23] Speaker B: But like now that you mentioned it. So that was, that was that. And you know, I kind of just was there and also feeling this idea of like being of service. Right. I know sometimes. What's this? [00:50:36] Speaker A: For the gig? [00:50:37] Speaker B: Yeah. Sometimes when we're, we get caught up in like the transactionality, if that's even a word, the transactionality of it all. Like, if I'm not getting paid this for this, for this, you know, and granted, I see, I see. Granted, this is coming from a relationship that had spanned. Now it's almost 20 year relationship that I had with Coco. So it's not something where it wasn't for the job. I wasn't trying to get a job out of this. This was something that I genuinely wanted to have and I want to see her do well and she has a great opportunity here and I want to help her. It wasn't. I'm helping her because I want to get to him and I want to do that. However it led to, because I came in with that spirit and not the spirit of what can I do? [00:51:23] Speaker A: Let me run this shit. [00:51:24] Speaker B: Let me, let me go. Yeah, let me go take this gig. [00:51:26] Speaker A: And run with it. [00:51:27] Speaker B: Yeah, let me go pitch something to him. And you know, because that wasn't the spirit that it came with, it eventually led to. Then there was another situation where he was, we were in center staging and they were playing music and I was in the corner and at that point I couldn't stop like dancing. [00:51:44] Speaker A: It was a moment saying like, how do you quietly tuck away anywhere while. [00:51:48] Speaker B: That'S playing but carry on and. And then he looked at me like hey, wait, do you have some movement to this? And I was like, again? And then that's when opportunity meets preparation, my friend. [00:51:59] Speaker A: Yes, absolutely. [00:52:00] Speaker B: And. And then. Yeah. So then it became a thing. And after that, he was like, okay, well, I'm doing a Saturday Night Live. [00:52:07] Speaker A: Amazing. [00:52:08] Speaker B: We did Saturday Night Live. Then we did. Then we went on tour, and we. Then. Then this was his first headlining tour in Australia. [00:52:18] Speaker A: That's significant. Now we're talking about building a machine. [00:52:20] Speaker B: And then. Exactly. Now, the Janet thing had happened in the summer of that year. This was now December of that same year. And I remember I had a flashback when, because I was also a dancer on it, I movement coached him, choreographed. And I was heavily involved in that process. And I will also shout out, aj, Harpold. [00:52:39] Speaker A: Yes, girl. [00:52:39] Speaker B: Because when I got that job, I didn't know. I knew what an MD was, but I didn't know my relation to the md, you know? Like, I didn't know. There was so many things I didn't know about being on this side, on the production side of it, on the choreography side. And she was one of the persons that I reached out to. She was gracious enough to give me some advice and some words. So shout out to you, aj. [00:53:01] Speaker A: We love you, aj. Aj, you've got to come on the podcast. [00:53:06] Speaker B: What? [00:53:07] Speaker A: Oh, it's happening. [00:53:08] Speaker B: Yes. Carry on. So we were in Australia, and I was not. I was on the side, not doing a number, and I was just. And then I was watching him and do something. And we had. Prepping for his tour. We had been like, okay, well, we see you're like the Prince of this era, but like Prince with James Brown, with, like, a little Elton John with, like, a little. With the flash and the thing, and you're like this combination of everyone but hip hop, too, and funk. And so there was this moment that we. Yeah, there was this. There was this moment that we. Now you got to do this moment. You know that moment where, like, James Brown has done it, Prince has done it, where they go down the mic, they bring the mic down, they have this dramatic pause. They have this dramatic pause, and then they just come up and boom. Crowd goes crazy, right? I was like, you got to do that. I was like, you got to do that and come down. [00:54:05] Speaker A: Nice. [00:54:06] Speaker B: Come down. We got to do that. The end of come down. You got to just like, to the. [00:54:10] Speaker A: Knee, to the knees, all the way. [00:54:11] Speaker B: Commit all the way down, and then come back up. I'm gonna get down. [00:54:15] Speaker A: You might never lost an area. [00:54:17] Speaker B: Yeah. Loss in area. That's how passionate it was. And at first it was like, no, I don't know. [00:54:24] Speaker A: And you were like, it's mechanics. And then it's feeling. When mechanics meet feelings. It's amazing. [00:54:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:54:29] Speaker A: This is how you get to your knees. This is how you get up. [00:54:31] Speaker B: Try it. [00:54:32] Speaker A: Okay, now feel good. And now try it again. And then it's amazing. [00:54:35] Speaker B: And then we did it. And then watching him do that on stage and watching the crowd react, I think that was a moment where I was like, ah. That was. Speaking of aha moment. That was an aha moment because I realized that I was getting more gratification and joy from watching something I helped from. Yeah, I was like, I helped him grow into that or I helped this show become this, as opposed to me being out there. [00:55:01] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:55:02] Speaker B: And of course, we love being a dancer once A dancer once. You'll always be a dancer. And you love the, the feeling of taking up space as a dancer and moving, being seen. The instant gratification of the audience and the connection. Hello. Which was great. It's addicting. That was a moment. That was an aha moment where I realized, like, wow, yeah, I am taking more joy in this. And I think that's also. That also has helped me transition into being more of a teacher and watching dancers grow and watching artists grow and watching being part of the creative process. You know, I love, I love the pre production. [00:55:44] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:55:44] Speaker B: Like, all the ideas flowing and I. [00:55:47] Speaker A: Could live there forever. [00:55:47] Speaker B: Bad idea. Good idea. [00:55:48] Speaker A: I could live there forever. [00:55:49] Speaker B: I love it. I could live there forever almost. Sometimes, like, when you see the finished product, you're like, okay, that's great. I love it. But it's the trenches, the trenches of the creative process that I love. [00:56:00] Speaker A: Nice. [00:56:00] Speaker B: So, yeah. [00:56:01] Speaker A: Well, thank you for sharing that story. I'm so glad that it's you and you are so perfect for that space. [00:56:05] Speaker B: Thank you. And I will just say also, Anderson is again, what I learned from him. He is fearless. He is creative. Like, he, he, he trusts his instincts and he just, he goes with it. And even now, like, he, he. He's DJing and he's, he's directing. He directed a film and he starred in the film. And he's just, he's not put. He doesn't allow himself to be put in a box. And that was a huge takeaways I got from working with him. And we're still good friends. And I am, you know, humble. He's super humble, but also talented and also demands excellence of himself and the people around him. And yeah, I, I Was privileged to be around him. I hope he comes out with more music. More music and another tour and I would love to. He loves dance. He's. We're always sending videos to each other of like, oh, did you see this? And did you see that? And so I. I can't wait to see what the future has. [00:57:05] Speaker A: Yeah. I am anxiously awaiting. [00:57:08] Speaker B: Yes. [00:57:09] Speaker A: Okay, final burnout round. You ready? [00:57:11] Speaker B: Okay. [00:57:12] Speaker A: Rapid fire. [00:57:12] Speaker B: Here we go. [00:57:13] Speaker A: Answer from the guts. [00:57:14] Speaker B: Instincts. [00:57:15] Speaker A: Kai. [00:57:16] Speaker B: Yes. [00:57:16] Speaker A: Is it coffee or is it tea? [00:57:18] Speaker B: Matcha tea. [00:57:19] Speaker A: Amazing. Is it a morning rehearsal or a night rehearsal? [00:57:22] Speaker B: Morning. [00:57:22] Speaker A: Nice. Is it hair down or hair up? [00:57:26] Speaker B: Hair up. [00:57:28] Speaker A: Is it a hoop or is it a stud? I think I. I know hoop. Great. Is it breakfast or is it dinner? [00:57:37] Speaker B: Dinner. Dinner. [00:57:38] Speaker A: Dinner or sneaker? [00:57:42] Speaker B: Sneaker or slide? It's a slide. For me living in la, this chapter is definitely a comfy slide. [00:57:51] Speaker A: Yeah. What do you splurge on? What in your life is something that you're like, ooh, that's worth the money? [00:57:57] Speaker B: I would say it's a toss up between experiences and self care. Like I've in this season I'm really like trying to take care of my body. And so I'm like, whereas before I would never have spent money on a massage or money on this. Now I'm like, no, I need it. [00:58:17] Speaker A: What's the experience that you're saving up for right now? [00:58:21] Speaker B: Oh, I'm going to go take my parents to Hawaii. [00:58:26] Speaker A: What island? [00:58:27] Speaker B: Honolulu. [00:58:28] Speaker A: Nice. Let's go spin off of that desert island. Worst case scenario, you have one album to listen to for the rest of time. What is it? [00:58:35] Speaker B: Okay, I would say, I know I Stevie Wonder songs in the key of life. [00:58:46] Speaker A: That's a good answer. Really good answer. [00:58:49] Speaker B: Complete. [00:58:49] Speaker A: What if you got to collaborate with one person, living or dead, who would it be? [00:58:52] Speaker B: Oh, I, I know he did this last time and I said, I said last time. But I think I have two. Can I say two? Yeah. One living and one non living. Bad bunny right now. [00:59:09] Speaker A: Oh yeah. That makes loads of sense. That makes. [00:59:13] Speaker B: That's a lot of to get in there. And non living Selena, I think that would have been so cool just to get in that. I feel like she would have been incredible. [00:59:25] Speaker A: Yo, if you were Coca Cola, those two people are polar bears like you. That's a full family thing that I see and that makes so much sense. That is alignment, that is consistency. [00:59:37] Speaker B: My friends. [00:59:38] Speaker A: Final question for you. Kai, thank you for like driving home. This idea of knowingness of self, of having a. A North Star, of having a guide that Brings you through your decisions in life, your values, your ups, your downs. I would love to know right now in this season, what are. What is that right now for you? The words that move you. What's your North Star? [01:00:04] Speaker B: Finding a path in the quietness. Right now it feels like I think we're collectively going through a season of quiet spaces. And what does that. How does. How are you coming out of that? How are you? How are you coming out of that? How are you? What are you. How are you showing up for yourself? I'd say for myself. Yeah, it's showing up for myself. The time is going to pass anyway, right. The plant, the seeds we're planting now are going to bear fruit a year from now. So what I'm doing now, it's not for me right now. [01:00:39] Speaker A: Ooh. [01:00:40] Speaker B: What I'm doing now is for a year from now. [01:00:43] Speaker A: That's beautiful. Thank you for sharing. Yeah, I think it's. It can be easy to get short sighted in times, period. It can be easy to be short sighted, period. Especially when you're a gig to gig kind of person. And then it's also easy to get really scared when there's not a next gig. So investing in the year from now gig versus, like, what do I do today? It's like, wait, today I dream. [01:01:08] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:01:09] Speaker A: About a year from now. And then I reverse engineer so that I know what to do today. [01:01:13] Speaker B: Yeah, plant the seed, baby. Yeah, plant the seed. And you know, not it to be. I've had this in a, like a manifestation book where it was like, imagine who the person is that has, like, what the things you want. Right. All that, like you said, the dream. [01:01:28] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:01:29] Speaker B: All the things that you want. And now what are the quality, qualities and attributes of the person that you need to become? Oh, yeah. To have that. [01:01:37] Speaker A: I love that. [01:01:37] Speaker B: And then it's like every day you just work towards becoming that and then you realize it's in the journey. Yes. You start falling in love with that. So. I know, girl, I love that and. [01:01:49] Speaker A: I love you and I love Riz and thank you so much for this conversation, Kai. I could do this all the time. I might even plant a technical error here so that we have to do this again, but I won't because you're wonderful. Thank you. [01:02:00] Speaker B: Thank you. Thank you so much. [01:02:01] Speaker A: Thank you, listener, viewer, for being here. Be sure to subscribe, leave a comment, let us know what you're loving about the pod and get out there into the world and keep it super funky. [01:02:11] Speaker B: Bye. [01:02:12] Speaker A: This podcast was produced by me with the help of many. Big, big love to our Executive Assistant and Editor, Riley Higgins. Our Communications Manager is Fiona Small, with additional support from Ori Vajadares. Our music is by Max Winnie, logo and brand design by Bri Reitz. And if you're digging the podcast, leave a review and rating and please, please share. Also, if you want to connect with me and the many marvelous members of the Words that Move Me community, visit Words that Move me. Com. If you're simply curious to know more about me and the work that I do outside of this podcast, visit thedanawilson. Com.